Podcast: West Side Story, The Tender Bar, Don't Look Up... and Faye Dunaway?
Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:00PM Nick and Nathaniel reunion finale (part 3 of 3). Dear readers we hope you've enjoyed this epic talk between your host here and the long lost Nick Davis. Here's the final part in which we talk more 2021 movies plus a discussion of Gena Rowlands and Faye Dunaway due to the new class Nick is teaching.
78 minutes
00:01 Lana Wachowski going full meta in Matrix Resurrections
10:15 Nick's trouble with Leos Carax's Annette (with some Pola X history)
17:50 Tony Kushner's reworking of West Side Story and its redux performances. Plus a bit of In the Heights thrown in for reasons Nathaniel objects to
32:00 France's Petite Maman and Austria's Great Freedom
39:30 Adam McKay's Don't Look Up and its limitations as well as the harsh critical response
47:00 An extremely odd double feature: Wes Anderson's The French Dispatch and George Clooney's The Tender Bar
BIG ACTRESSEXUAL FINISH
1:01:06 Nick is teaching a class called "Female Performance in Modern Hollywood" so we discuss our favourite Faye Dunaway and Gena Rowlands performances (with very brief asides to several other post-Method actresses)
You can listen to the podcast on iTunes, Stitcher or Spotify or download the attachment below. If you missed our previous recent discussion covering a full dozen 2021 movies, that's here.
Reader Comments (18)
Saw "In the Heights" at last and... it's OK, at some moments, it's really good, but felt overlong, really, really overlong (I mean, it felt like we had over 90 minutes of runtime and I looked at my watch, and we were not finished even the first hour, and there were almost 90 minutes left!). On the work of Miranda... it's his original musical that I have actually kind of liked (was meh on Encanto, bored to death by Vivo, and couldn't stand more than 15 minutes of Hamilton), and the only thing I have loved, is "Tick Tick Boom" which, of course, despite being directed by him, is not his musical.
On "In the Heights" vs. "West Side Story", Spielberg clearly deservingly wins by a landslide... the main problem in "In the Heights" (as in every Miranda musical I've seen) is... blandness. It lacks bite. His work reminds me of that "Blades of Glory" quick gag about Will Arnett's and Amy Poehler's villainous characters, skating making a number "connecting with the youth" and in which they dress ridiculously as what Disney Channel would think, teenagers are... bland, campy, etc. And that's "In the Heights" main problem. Even when a character die, the impact is really lost quite fast, because Miranda is obsessed with not disturbing his material and the mood he creates for the audience, with any negative feeling... therefore, the overall material lacks actual weight and impact, and the message he tries to deliver, "heritage", is lost in the mix, and with a terrible "Deus ex Machina" (actually two, but one of them completely forecasted at the beginning, despite his efforts to make us forget about that element, but it was OBVIOUS all along).
Now, there's no question why West Side Story stole all attention... it's not just Spielberg, it's the fact that WSS is a masterclass and In the Heights just a good adaptation.
Re: West Side Story (SPOILERS AHEAD)
For me, where the film misses in the Maria-Anita interaction ("A Boy Like That"/"I Have a Love") is the staging. Suddenly the camera becomes static and stagy and Spielberg lets the two actresses "stand and deliver" like opera singers. It really needed dynamic camerawork and blocking, especially to sell what comes during and after Shrank's entrance in the next scene.
I didn't have a problem with "Pretty" or "Krupke," except the way "Krupke" ended, which was very musical theater (and not musical drama like so much of the rest of the film). They all just run out of the station?!?
And the ending did feel rushed, which I attribute to them not adding a new Maria sequence (even one without dialogue) and to the fact that I never bought the great love story between Tony and Maria, which is the great challenge for every production of WSS (or R & J for that matter).
But despite all that, I thought the film was incredible and on the whole I prefer it to the '61 version (which I've loved for years and years).
PS. Nathaniel, his last name is pronounced FYEst, not FAYst.
These have been such a treat - thank you!
Were you two fans of Jeffrey Wright's performance? He seems to be the consensus French Dispatch standout. Any other supporting actors stand out to you this year that haven't gotten much attention?
Jesus -- we will have to agree to disagree on nearly every point you make. And, what's more, i dont even know what you're referring to about the deus ex machina x 2 in In the Heights -- i cant recall what could qualify as that... let alone two of them!
Vanessa -- he was my favourite in the film with ease, yeah, dont know about Nick.
Nick could do a full class on the 74 line up alone,Perrine is my pick that year,good listen though I haven't seen any of the films discussed apart from DLU which was horrible bar Cate and Jennifer.
Nathaniel, I think one of the deus ex machinas he means is everything revolving the lottery ticket, which I kind of agree with. It can be a bit frustrating when a plot hinges on someone winning the lottery.
As for The French Dispatch, the standout from the film for me is Benicio Del Toro (which may also have to do with me preferring the first story over the third one, though they're both terrific. I wish he were getting some attention, though no performance in a Wes Anderson film has ever been nominated for an Oscar, and if they didn't nominate Ralph Fiennes for Grand Budapest, there was no chance they would nominate a performance from a film without a clear lead.
Richter -- but IN THE HEIGHTS is not about its plot. So i guess i still dont understand the complaint. Musicals are rarely about the plot and usually about their song setpieces
agree with you on Wes films and Oscar of course since Fiennes won my gold medal that year.
Count me in as another who would love to take Nick’s class on Female Performance.
I haven’t seen these films for a while, but I loved Gena Rowlands in Love Streams, Gloria, and Minnie & Moskowitz. I think Gena is a great choice for an Everywoman character. I like it when Everywomen are distinctive, brainy, original, artistic, unapologetic types.
I hope the Age Of Adam Driver lasts for decades, and is joined by the Age of Michael Shannon. And I keep hoping that the Age of some of Oscar’s usual suspects will soon be over. I won’t list these actors (not actresses) because it would be uncharitable and also because I realize that there are so many of them that I just wish would go away, that I realize I have to concentrate on more positive things.
Thank you Nathaniel for reiterating this response to a dictum:
Just turn your brain off and enjoy things!
But what if my brain is where I enjoy things?
Nathaniel, as an actressexual you have one job. One job! Go see A Woman Under The influence!
And for those who want to get to know Gena, start with my favorite movie of all time, Love Streams. It's Gena and Cassavetes, but much more accessible, and still piercing and emotional.
It's nice that Nick thinks Blanchett in Blue Jasmine gives a Gena-like performance. It is! But you know that an actor and not an actress delivered the most Gena Rowlands performance of all time not acted by her: Mathieu Amalric in Kings and Queen (another personal favorite).
Nathaniel can never talk about Leo without giving him a backhanded compliment or letting his contempt for him known. It’s been that way for over a decade now and it’s getting old. He gave the best performance in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood and that was only a few years ago.
From the Facebook page An Open Secret:
SHOCKING video of a teenage Leonardo DiCaprio on the set of Growing Pains being minded by Brian Peck, a well known convicted pedophile and close friend of X-Men Movies director Bryan Singer and Charlie Sheen. In this video Peck calls Leo the “latest, hottest, hunkiest teen idol there is.”
Furthermore, Steven Marshall, the executive producer of Growing Pains was arrested for child pornography in 2010 and was sentenced to 7.5 years in prison. We detail Brian Peck and also Leo DiCaprio’s former publicist Bob Villard who is also a convicted pedophile in our documentary An Open Secret.
Leo worked closely with pedophiles while on the set of Growing Pains.
Kay -- Nathaniel nominated him for Hollywood, and had him as an honorable mention in 2015 and 2013. Hardly contempt - that's a better record than nearly any male actor in that timeframe.
@Cal Roth: Hahaha....I'll underscore that I think the Blue Jasmine performance shows the signs of being intended as a Gena homage, and not just because Cate talks so often about Gena's influence on her in general. I especially feel this link in some of Blanchett's more erratic and exciting scene work in BJ ("I saw you, Erica!!") and in the way she plays some of the character's mania. But it's also very much Cate and very much Blanche and very much a lot of things, and I hear you! : )
Nathaniel: There will always be moviegoers who walk into a movie and focus mainly on the plot (many of them are on YouTube making a living out of nitpicking the plots of every movie to death), whether they are musicals or not, and while I agree that In the Heights specifically is not as concerned with its plot, I would argue there have been several musicals that have managed to use their music to move the plot forward brilliantly (which is why more contemporary musicals tend to have more intricate plots, sometimes to their detriment, but when they work). Sondheim was a master at this, writing music that made for a memorable song sequence, but also mimicked conversations in a way that not only revealed so much about the characters in his musicals, but moved the story forward (Sweeney Todd is great at this), and Howard Ashman was also brilliant at this (one of many reasons I love Beauty and the Beast is because every single song either reveals character or moves the plot forward).
Richter Scale -- i agree with you that some great musicals do this and songs *should* move the plot forward in a plot musical (in the same way that great action movies are thinking about story during their "setpieces" but what i mean is that In the Heights is not a "story" musical and never intends to be. West Side Story is a story musical. In the Heights is conceived as more of a mosaic of a community and a place, with different characters getting their mini showcases of their piece of the mosaic in song. It's just not a story musical in any real way.
Vanessa & Kay -- hi My feelings on Leo have varied wildly from film to film. I loved him at the beginning but then i began to have trouble because i felt he was no longer challenging himself or was challenging himself in the same "i am a serious actor!!!" kind of way over and over again. But when he's 'on' he can be amazing. if i ran the world he would have received 4 Oscar nominations in this career:
SUPPORTING ACTOR - what's eating gilbert grape (1993)
LEAD ACTOR - romeo + juliet (1996)
LEAD ACTOR - the departed (2006)
LEAD ACTOR - once upon a time ...in hollywood (2019)
so, in short, i do not love him in the way Oscar and the general public loves him but i do think he's talented and rarely bad (with a couple of exceptions). I feel that whenever an actor is clearly worshipped (as, say, Meryl or Leo are) people automatically interpret people who aren't blown away every single time as somehow hating them.
Nick -- "I saw you Erica!" I wish I had a close friend named Erica so that I could relentlessly quote that to her in Cate voice.
Y'all can argue about West Side Story (it's fine) v In the Heights (it gets better with every viewing), Leo (I've always been case-by-case with him, sometimes he's extraordinary and other times frustrating, but I admire his propensity for working with auteurs/exciting directors), and everything else...I'm just here to say that Nathaniel absolutely has to see Another Woman!
I feel weird encouraging someone to watch a Woody Allen movie, and I completely understand anyone's aversion to doing so, but everything Nick said about it is true. Hopefully one day you'll be able to watch A Woman Under the Influence as well, but that's a long one and I find it overwhelming/emotionally draining (in the best way) so I definitely understand staying away until you feel you're in a good enough state of mind to experience it.
Y'all can argue about West Side Story (it's fine) v In the Heights (it gets better with every viewing), Leo (I've always been case-by-case with him, sometimes he's extraordinary and other times frustrating, but I admire his propensity for working with auteurs/exciting directors), and everything else...I'm just here to say that Nathaniel absolutely has to see Another Woman!
I feel weird encouraging someone to watch a Woody Allen movie, and I completely understand anyone's aversion to doing so, but everything Nick said about it is true. Hopefully one day you'll be able to watch A Woman Under the Influence as well, but that's a long one and I find it overwhelming/emotionally draining (in the best way) so I definitely understand staying away until you feel you're in a good enough state of mind to experience it.
Hi Nathaniel,
I realized a while ago that, as far as the podcasts go, I'm meant to only be a Best Supporting. However, seeing that photo of Faye, I had to throw in/out this quote:
"I don't get tough with anyone, Mr. Gittes. My lawyer does?!..."